Legislature(1993 - 1994)

03/29/1993 03:00 PM House HES

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
  Number 366                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked if the Department of Education                    
  (DOE) could tell the committee what impact the amendments                    
  just passed would have on the list of school projects                        
  outlined in HB 83.                                                           
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said it would be premature, as he intended to                    
  rewrite HB 83 thoroughly.                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 379                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said he had been provided HB 83, a list                 
  of projects and an appropriations bill with $150 million                     
  going to those projects.  He asked if the changes to HB 82                   
  would change the amount of money available for the projects                  
  in HB 83.                                                                    
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said that, while he hesitated to speak for the                   
  DOE, the percentages under consideration by the DOE were not                 
  the same as those presented by the DOE.  He said the changes                 
  were revenue-positive.                                                       
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG said the committee might at least have                 
  to make HB 83 not subject to the changes in HB 82, because                   
  he was sure that HB 83 represented money available before                    
  any changes, and that if the committee changed the funding                   
  figures in HB 82 it would throw off the numbers in the                       
  priority list.                                                               
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE said that the committee would have to                   
  change the effective date on HB 82.  He said the committee                   
  should keep in mind that it could establish various                          
  effective dates for different parts of the bill.                             
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE IRENE NICHOLIA asked a representative from                    
  the DOE to explain the impacts of the changes in the                         
  district participating share provisions of HB 82 on Rural                    
  Education Attendance Areas (REAAs).                                          
                                                                               
  Number 412                                                                   
                                                                               
  GARY BADER, DIRECTOR, DIVISION OF ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICES,                   
  DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION said, "It is very difficult to say,                  
  the first question about overall, would it require more                      
  state money to fund the same list, or less, (I) simply can't                 
  say without actually running the numbers.  The table is                      
  different, the match requirements are different.  As you                     
  recall, HB 83 as it's before you without the committee                       
  substitute, has a sliding scale on the first year.  The                      
  matching requirements weren't as aggressive as they were                     
  further out.  So it's just impossible to say."                               
                                                                               
  MR. BADER continued, "In terms of the REAAs, clearly we have                 
  a zero match the first year.  This committee substitute                      
  would have a 5% match.  And so in terms of the dollar amount                 
  of match that would have to be raised, I couldn't say, but                   
  we can certainly get a feel for it."                                         
                                                                               
  HB 83:  APPROP: SCHOOL CONSTRUCTION GRANT FUND                               
                                                                               
  Number 170                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE opened public testimony on HB 83.                                
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY distributed copies of a blank CS                        
  version of HB 83.                                                            
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG asked if the CS version of HB 83 was                   
  different from the version under consideration earlier.                      
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE asked Representative Vezey to address the                        
  question.                                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 179                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY said that the CS contained changes in                   
  the funding source.  The original funding source for HB 83                   
  was to have been a school construction fund, the name of                     
  which he could not recall.  The CS to HB 83 discussed in the                 
  HESS subcommittee which he chaired considered the General                    
  Fund as a source of funding.  The blank CS currently before                  
  the committee assumed the constitutional budget reserve as                   
  its source of funding, he said.                                              
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA asked Representative Vezey if he                     
  followed the governor's priority in writing his work draft.                  
  She observed that some of the construction proposals in the                  
  work draft were low on the governor's list.                                  
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY replied in the negative.                                
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA repeated her question.                               
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY repeated his answer.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 206                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said the governor's priority list did not come                   
  close to allocating funds in relation to the percentage of                   
  students in a district or area.  He said that the blank CS                   
  was an attempt to allocate the funds more equitably; the                     
  more students in a district, the more projects it received.                  
  The governor's construction projects' proposal invested 9%                   
  in Anchorage, 8% in Fairbanks, 3% in Mat-Su, and 0.3% in                     
  Kenai, but 56% in REAAs, he said.  In the CS, the funding                    
  was distributed in approximate proportion to the                             
  distribution of the student population in the state, he                      
  said.                                                                        
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE pointed out that the title called for                            
  appropriation from the constitutional budget reserve, and                    
  called that a major step forward which he believed deserved                  
  to be noted.                                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 231                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked for comment from the DOE, and                     
  asked a departmental representative if he had seen the list                  
  earlier.                                                                     
                                                                               
  MR. BADER answered that the list contained in the blank CS                   
  was presented in the subcommittee two weeks before.  He said                 
  he could not comment, and added that when the DOE assembled                  
  the list it had not tried to balance it according to                         
  percentages of money spent by each school district.                          
                                                                               
  Number 245                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE NICHOLIA said the governor had written his                    
  list based on how long schools had been waiting for funding,                 
  and on whether the funding addressed life-threatening                        
  situations.                                                                  
                                                                               
  MR. BADER said the governor's list was built according to an                 
  internal DOE ranking of all projects statewide, and that                     
  there was a decision to spend approximately $40 million on                   
  maintenance, with the balance coming from the school                         
  construction account.                                                        
                                                                               
  Number 261                                                                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE had a letter from the governor seeking a                         
  technical adjustment to the funding list.  He said the                       
  Ketchikan Gateway Borough High School was already under                      
  construction, and that the funding amount in HB 83 should be                 
  $9,501,600.  He said there had been a funding error, which                   
  the governor's suggested funding level would correct.                        
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE MOVED an AMENDMENT to increase the                      
  Ketchikan High School line to the level requested by the                     
  governor.                                                                    
                                                                               
  Number 279                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY OBJECTED.  He did not believe it was                    
  possible to simply add money to that project without cutting                 
  funding elsewhere in the bill.  He opposed any motion to add                 
  an increment without taking a corresponding decrement.                       
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said the committee would discuss the decrement                   
  after addressing the increment.                                              
                                                                               
  Number 290                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE G. DAVIS said that HB 83 drew money from the                  
  constitutional budget reserve.  He said any additions to the                 
  bill could simply be added to the bill, and the additional                   
  money withdrawn from that reserve fund.                                      
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG asked Representative Brice to amend                    
  his motion to increase the total appropriation by the same                   
  amount as it increased money for the Ketchikan High School,                  
  which he said was $2,850,500, as stated in the governor's                    
  letter.                                                                      
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY did not believe the motion was                          
  necessary, as the $8,240,000 in the blank CS was a state                     
  grant, and if there was a 20% local match, the project would                 
  have enough money to be completed.                                           
                                                                               
  Number 305                                                                   
                                                                               
  MR. BADER said the project had been going on for several                     
  years.  The DOE believed Ketchikan had already met its                       
  obligation for matching funds, he said, which was the reason                 
  the appropriation amount was understated.  He said the                       
  school project was in its final phase, and short-funding it                  
  by about $1.3 million would force the addition of another                    
  phase to the project, and add expenses.                                      
                                                                               
  There followed much general discussion among committee                       
  members relating to the total amount of money necessary to                   
  fund the various phases of the high school building project,                 
  how much money had already been appropriated for it, and how                 
  much of the Ketchikan school district's obligation for local                 
  matching funds had already been provided.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 355                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE CALLED THE QUESTION.                                    
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE acknowledged the call for the question of                        
  whether the committee should amend the working draft of                      
  HB 83 to increase the appropriation to the Ketchikan Gateway                 
  Borough for the final construction phase of its high school                  
  building project to $9,501,600.  He called for a roll call                   
  vote on the motion.  Those voting YEA were Representatives                   
  G. Davis, Olberg, B. Davis, Nicholia, Brice, Toohey, and                     
  Bunde.  Those voting NO were Representatives Vezey, and                      
  Kott.  The MOTION PASSED.                                                    
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said that the committee then faced the question                  
  of whether to increase the total appropriation by                            
  $1,261,666, or whether there should be a decrement in that                   
  amount to the total appropriation amount.                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE believed the motion was to increase the                 
  total appropriation.                                                         
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said that the committee had already increased                    
  the Ketchikan portion but had not decided if there would be                  
  a decrement.  He asked if Representative Brice was making a                  
  motion to increase the total appropriation by the $1,261,666                 
  making the total appropriation $109,441,663.                                 
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE CALLED THE QUESTION.                                    
                                                                               
  Number 450                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG asked if the committee was working                     
  from HB 83 or from the CS for the bill.  He was notified                     
  that the committee was working from the CS version.  He then                 
  asked if the committee was amending the amount in section 1                  
  as well as the amount of the appropriation.                                  
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said the committee had amended line 12 to read                   
  $9,501,600.                                                                  
                                                                               
  Further discussion followed.                                                 
                                                                               
  Number 465                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE announced that he had to leave for                      
  another engagement, and asked the chair's intention.                         
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE intended to have a vote on the bill soon.                        
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE asked for 15 to 20 minutes.                             
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE noted that there was an amendment on the table                   
  to increase the total amount of the appropriation to                         
  $109,446,663.  He called for further discussion.                             
                                                                               
  Number 470                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY OPPOSED the AMENDMENT because the                       
  committee would get unlimited requests for additional                        
  projects, and $150 million in FY 94 school spending had been                 
  agreed upon.  Without some discipline, he said, the requests                 
  for more funding for school construction would be unlimited.                 
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE G. DAVIS could not disagree with a little                     
  discipline, and stated there had been some dispute about the                 
  numbers.  He did not want to see the state's share of the                    
  Ketchikan High School project reduced, as his district had                   
  experienced the shock of the state reducing its share of                     
  school funding, and leaving it up to the local school                        
  district to make up the difference.  He said it was                          
  impossible for the committee to deduce the meaning of the                    
  governor's letter.  He said he would support the legislation                 
  as a way to reduce the shock to the people of Ketchikan.                     
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE asked for more discussion, and hearing none,                     
  called for a roll call vote on the amendment.  Those voting                  
  YEA were Representatives Kott, Olberg, B. Davis, Nicholia,                   
  Toohey, Bunde, and G. Davis.  Representative Vezey voted NO.                 
  The MOTION PASSED.                                                           
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE announced that the appropriation from the                        
  constitutional budget reserve in HB 83 was $109,446,663.  He                 
  called for discussion.                                                       
                                                                               
  Number 500                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE OLBERG asked if the committee was willing to                  
  dive into the constitutional budget reserve at that point.                   
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said he was ready to do so.                                      
                                                                               
  Number 506                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE PETE KOTT SUGGESTED a TECHNICAL AMENDMENT to                  
  page 5 line 25, concerning $1.2 million for a new Eagle                      
  River elementary school road, and said that he would like to                 
  see the money used for roads, even though it was probably                    
  appropriated to schools.                                                     
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said he could not speak to the correctness of                    
  the list, as it was taken from the governor's list.  He                      
  examined the original HB 83, and asked Representative Vezey                  
  to offer information on the project.                                         
                                                                               
  Number 518                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE VEZEY said the best information the committee                 
  had was the information in the bill, and that Representative                 
  Kott was the first to question it.                                           
                                                                               
  MR. BADER SUGGESTED that DELETING the word "roads" from the                  
  language in question and INSERTING the words "new                            
  elementary" would probably cover the intended purpose, and                   
  allow the money to be used for either purpose.                               
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE asked Representative Kott if he would make such                  
  a motion.                                                                    
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE KOTT MOVED AMENDING page 5, line 25 to DELETE                 
  the word "roads" from the language in question and INSERT                    
  the words "new Eagle River elementary."                                      
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY said, "If we could build a school for                  
  $1 million, I'd say let's do it.  I don't think we can."                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE B. DAVIS said the money must be for site                      
  preparation, not a whole school.                                             
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE asked if the committee had the original                          
  information the projects were taken from.  He said                           
  Representative B. Davis was probably correct.                                
                                                                               
  Number 555                                                                   
                                                                               
  JOE RYAN, LEGISLATIVE AIDE TO REPRESENTATIVE AL VEZEY,                       
  testified in Juneau on HB 83.  He said that the Anchorage                    
  School District did not appropriate money for roads when it                  
  built the school.  Since that time, inflation had raised the                 
  cost of roads to the price listed in HB 83, he said.                         
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE KOTT WITHDREW his AMENDMENT.                                  
                                                                               
  Number 562                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE MOVED an AMENDMENT to page 3, line 19                   
  of the bill, to ADD $61,631,000 for phase two of a Fairbanks                 
  North Star Borough high school.                                              
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE RULED Representative Brice OUT OF ORDER.                         
                                                                               
  Number 572                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY OBJECTED.                                              
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said, "Now, back to reality.  Representative                     
  Brice, would you like us to vote on that amendment?                          
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE indicated that he did, indeed, want the                 
  committee to vote on his amendment, when he had finished                     
  reading it.  He said his amendment also included changes to                  
  page 1, line 5, increasing the total appropriation to                        
  $170,811,963.                                                                
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE continued, "Any other discussion?  May we vote                   
  us back to reality?"                                                         
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY reminded the chair that she had                        
  objected to the motion.                                                      
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE said that the committee would then vote.                         
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE B. DAVIS added, "I thought he was just                        
  kidding, but if he's serious I need to know what he wants us                 
  to vote on.  Because if we're going to play that game then I                 
  guess we could all start putting some out."                                  
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE threatened, "If we're going to play that game,                   
  we'll adjourn.  If he wants $61 million for a high school in                 
  Fairbanks, a noble cause, but..."                                            
                                                                               
  A roll call vote showed that those voting YEA were                           
  Representatives Brice, and Vezey. Those voting NO were                       
  Representatives Kott, Olberg, B. Davis, Nicholia, Toohey,                    
  Bunde, and G. Davis.  The MOTION FAILED.                                     
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE BRICE noted for the record that he and                        
  Representative Vezey had voted together on an issue, setting                 
  a record.                                                                    
                                                                               
  TAPE 93-51, SIDE A                                                           
  Number 026                                                                   
                                                                               
  REPRESENTATIVE TOOHEY MOVED PASSAGE OF THE BILL WITH                         
  INDIVIDUAL RECOMMENDATIONS.                                                  
                                                                               
  CHAIR BUNDE heard OBJECTION to the motion, and called for a                  
  roll call vote.  After a brief interruption from                             
  Representative Kott, the chair ordered the roll call vote to                 
  resume.  Those voting YEA were Representatives Olberg, B.                    
  Davis, Nicholia, Toohey, Bunde, G. Davis, Vezey, and Kott.                   
  Representative Brice voted NO.  The MOTION PASSED.                           
                                                                               
  ADJOURNMENT                                                                  
                                                                               
  Seeing no further business before the committee, CHAIR BUNDE                 
  adjourned the meeting at 4:40 p.m.                                           

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